Hadn't caught wind of this, but it's disturbing. If Linux gaming becomes dominated by running Windows games on Linux, then we'll have taken a step backward that'd put us right where we were 10+ yrs ago
"If you have released a Linux version of your game on Steam and are directly approached by Valve about using Proton instead, please get in touch (DMs open). They've already done this a few times, but I would like to see how aggressive they're planning to be going forward"
https://twitter.com/flibitijibibo/status/1416118465442852869
Obviously, I'm still committed to/keen to invest effort in helping other developers find positive experiences with supporting #Linux directly. Always happy to have a chat any time.
@Samsai Yeah. Porting has never been my primary job, so I'm not as affected as flibit and others, but I've definitely noticed the impact of Valve's actions over the past few years on my ability to get porting work and on how many developers approach me for assistance with Linux hurdles.
I always hoped that my article on Proton back in 2018 would be viewed as a cautionary reminder about what we as users shouldn't be willing to give up, but people were so happy to embrace it with such fervour
Silly question, and only tangentially related, but:
Have you talked to the Linux Sizecoding folks? (The ones making 4 kilobyte or smaller intros (small demoscene demos) for demoparties etc?)
Or to folks doing shader work on Linux related to the demoscene?
If not, and you want to talk to a few, I know where a few are on the fediverse, and they might be open to mutual discussion etc.
(I would like to do this but I would also like to have no burnout and be healthy. So that first.)
@Truck I have not! If they're already Linux-based devs, then in the context of this discussion, they don't need me
@vidak The contents of that tweet was quoted in the text there. Valve have apparently been approaching developers with Linux builds about using Proton instead
No, not in the context of THIS discussion.
But in the context of other Linux game/entertainment type discussions.
@Truck Oh, right. Could be interesting to explore, but I'm pretty swamped at the moment
@Cheeseness Most of our favorite Windows games still won't work at all in Linux, even with Proton. It's just not very good.
cc: @Harena
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@kazriko You might have mixed the context here. That's a porter known for solid ports talking about how Valve has been approaching his clients about using Proton instead - unless you're suggesting that Ethan doesn't do a good job?
From a bigger picture perspective, I think it's *super* important to be supportive of developers who're trying even if their first ports/platform support is a little shaky. The alternative only drives less-experienced developers away before they have a chance to learn
@suetanvil So, this is a healthy way to approach this kind of tech IMO, but it is very much not reflective of how Valve is pitching Proton and the Steam Deck to developers and the users that will end up making up the majority of Steam's Linux user base if the Steam Deck sells the kind of numbers they've talked about expecting to hit. That healthy perspective does not align with Valve's roadmap.
(game dev and porter here)
@woozle @Harena Horses for courses - I haven't had a Windows game that didn't work with vanilla Wine since bugs that affected StarCraft 2 got fixed a decade ago.
One of the key concerns here is that Valve's stated goal is to "get every game to work by the time we ship Steam Deck." Regardless of whether or not that is realised, it is the perception and expectation that is being crafted around the stack, and it will have an impact on how developers approach supporting Linux.
@kazriko The topic of conversation here is Valve effectively poaching developers with solid Linux ports.
@Cheeseness
I wish I knew how that worked. Luxor 1 only loads sometimes, Luxor 3 won't run at all, and Luxor HD -- when it would run, which was reliably at first and now kind of not at all -- had graphics glitches.
Zuma 2 also won't run at all.
I suppose I should properly document all this, in case it's useful for diagnosis.
@kazriko Which feels even more problematic to me - it definitely moves against the outcomes that those of us who've been working to help developers find positive experiences/overcome hurdles/learn to better support the platform for the past decade are aiming for.
@suetanvil Regardless of the hardware's success, Valve still have massive clout/influence over developers' perceptions. Anecdotally, I've already seen a decline in interest/work since Proton was integrated with Steam (to be clear, I don't really care about losing work opportunities - my priority is always setting developers up to support Linux on their own in the future)
@woozle @Harena Are they both Popcap games? I don't think I've played either (I played the original Zuma in Wine, but not for many years).
I can see people here sharing tips on getting it running that might be helpful for you. Seems like very minor configuration tweaks for Zuma's Revenge https://www.protondb.com/app/3620
I think Zuma is Popcap and Luxor is either Popcap or GameHouse or... both? Not sure how these things work.
In any case, I will take a look at that link!
@woozle @Harena The Wine AppDB also has an entry, but the result are from a very old Wine version which may or may not reflect the current state of things https://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=version&iId=18454
@libc Sometimes feels like that's the future that certain actors are pushing for >_<